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Amphetamine logic
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claws
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PostPost #1  Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 9:52 pm    Post subject: Amphetamine logic Reply with quote Back to top

I was thinking about the words "nothing but the knife to live for". What does this mean? Is he suicidal? (awesome song by the way)
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Quiff Boy
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PostPost #2  Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

i always assumed it was a "hot knife", for the drugs Wink
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claws
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PostPost #3  Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

can you explain a little more? I'm not familiar with the drug world
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PostPost #4  Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

isn't it something along the lines of putting your Speed on the knife, running a flame underneath it then sucking up the fumes?

Speed's never been my cup of tea so I'm not 100% on that one.
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khepri II
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PostPost #5  Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

CellThree wrote:
isn't it something along the lines of putting your Speed on the knife, running a flame underneath it then sucking up the fumes?

Speed's never been my cup of tea so I'm not 100% on that one.



yep that sums it up. from what i've been told It wasn't me... It wasn't me... Wink
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PostPost #6  Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Quiff Boy wrote:
i always assumed it was a "hot knife", for the drugs Wink


my guess is actually cutting it with a blade Rolling Eyes Confused
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MrChris
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PostPost #7  Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

There's also the cutting up people option / echo - See Ribbons. A Sweeney Todd angle would fit in with the other Eliot references in the poem.
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PostPost #8  Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

MrChris wrote:
There's also the cutting up people option / echo - See Ribbons.

true... Our fearless leader!
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PostPost #9  Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

eliot's "sweeney" poems arent actually about sweeney todd are they? its a common misconception isnt it?

http://www.bc.edu/publications/bcm/winter_2001/ll_poet.html

Quote:
I asked Eliot about the prototype of the rough-and-ready Sweeney image in his poems -- for example, in "Sweeney Erect" and "Sweeney Agonistes." He had commented once, "It happens that I know many Sweeneys, some of them among friends of mine. I happen to like the name. It has a pleasant sound."

Among his friends named Sweeney was John Lincoln Sweeney, a humanities preceptor at Harvard. At the River Club, I said, "Your classmate, Conrad Aiken, traces Sweeney to your boxing instructor in the South End of Boston."

"There were others," Eliot said -- among them the bartender at the Opera Exchange, also in Boston, where he had gathered with friends in his Harvard student days, circling Champagne corks on the table in a fortune-telling game. Eliot lifted his forefinger and waved it in a circle.


and

http://artsedge.kennedy-center.org/teaching_materials/curricula/curriculum.cfm?curriculum_id=348&mode=objectives

Quote:
8. consider the development of the Sweeney figure that threads through folklore and literature as a metaphorical statement for the dehumanization of man caused by the injustices, loss of spiritual connections, and alienation of the individual from others in the modern world.

...

11. consider evidences of Expressionism in the two musicals, particularly Sweeney Todd.


and

Quote:
To begin the study of Sweeney Todd, initiate a class discussion of the name "Sweeney." T.S.Eliot's poem, "Sweeney Among the Nightingales" could serve as a centerpiece of the discussion. Point out that Eliot wrote another Sweeney poem, "Sweeney Erect," and a drama, "Sweeney Agonistes." Encourage students to see that, through several historical and archetypal contrasts, Eliot characterizes Sweeney as a gross representative of modern human beings—one who is impotent in spirit, incapable of using violence to vent heroic passions. Note particularly the physical profile Eliot builds of Sweeney: "Apeneck," knees spread, arms hanging down, zebra stripes along his jaw, etc. All of these are "ape-like" characteristics.

In 10th, 11th, and 12th grade classes, consider initiating a discussion of the Freudian concept of the"id." Point out that Eliot's work has inculcated in Western consciousness the name "Sweeney" as being synonymous with one driven by his "id," projecting lustful, crude, primitive, and animal-like behavior.


so arent they saying that the todd story/musical is complete fiction which uses the name sweeney in a deliberate attempt to tie in with the sweeney portrayed in eliot's writing?

Eliot's work has inculcated in Western consciousness the name "Sweeney" as being synonymous with one driven by his "id," projecting lustful, crude, primitive, and animal-like behavior.

"Eliot's work has inculcated in Western consciousness the name "Sweeney" as being synonymous with one driven by his "id," projecting lustful, crude, primitive, and animal-like behavior."

Confused
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PostPost #10  Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Huh! Now that's very interesting, Quiffy! I have learned something very interesting today. I feel I should ring my parents or something. Except I only speak to one of them, and she wouldn't be interested. The question remains whether there couldn't still be a cutting people up reference, but it now looks much more tenuous! It boils down to the following:
Nothing but the knife to live for
ONE LIFE, all I need
The second line still sounds a bit Ripperesque to me.
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khepri II
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PostPost #11  Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

http://www.myheartland.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1350&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=sweeny%20todd&start=213

good ol' PIB
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Silver_Owl
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PostPost #12  Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I think you're all reading far too much into it.
I'm not a big speed freak but I would agree with the earlier idea that it's all to do with cutting up the crystals. Good speed needs chopping so it seems pretty obvious to me that he wasn't thinking about poems when he wrote it. We all know how ill he made himself with the stuff.
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zaltys7
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PostPost #13  Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2003 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Steve303 wrote:
I think you're all reading far too much into it.
I'm not a big speed freak but I would agree with the earlier idea that it's all to do with cutting up the crystals. Good speed needs chopping so it seems pretty obvious to me that he wasn't thinking about poems when he wrote it. We all know how ill he made himself with the stuff.


I agree with Steve, in my teenage years I consumed massive amounts of the stuff and the whole ritual of cutting, chopping, bagging and snorting was a very important one.

At that time in my life (long, long ago) I knew people who didnt even like the Sisters very much who would watch the Wake video while they where off their heads on Phet just because of the lovely red and blue colours and the trippy effects. It was the general consenses that these colours enhanced the amphetamine experience, and the knowledge that Mr Eldritch was himself a speed freek just made it that much better.

Amphetamine logic may have many different and hidden meanings but if he wrote it while he was on the stuff he probably cant even remember what they are.

Thats the nature of the drug, you sort the whole fu*king planet out, but once you've been to sleep two days later and finally eaten something it kinda all seems like a waste of time (and liver). Neutral

Paul
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PostPost #14  Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2003 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Here Here.
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PostPost #15  Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2003 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

wrap means something so different these days *sigh*
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PostPost #16  Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

You could use some skunk instead of speed on yer hot knife, but somehow I don't think the song would be sung at the same pace if the Baron was on about weed (Sisters Of Mercy In A Dub Reagge Stylee, hmmm) Laughing
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PostPost #17  Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2003 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Of course, the Sisters have released a reggae song...it's called Marian (version)...
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PostPost #18  Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2003 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

MrChris wrote:
Of course, the Sisters have released a reggae song...it's called Marian (version)...

Yah! Very Happy
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PostPost #19  Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Right, I'm digging up old threads again, but I was just reading The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock and found this couplet: (lines 35 & 36)
Quote:
In the room the women come and go
Talking of Michelangelo.
Which is cleverly punned upon in this
Quote:
(Women)
And the women come and go
(Talk)
Talking about me like they know

It has the same rhythm, the same 8-syllable last line, it even sounds similar.
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PostPost #20  Posted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

markfiend wrote:
Right, I'm digging up old threads again, but I was just reading The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock and found this couplet: (lines 35 & 36)
Quote:
In the room the women come and go
Talking of Michelangelo.
Which is cleverly punned upon in this
Quote:
(Women)
And the women come and go
(Talk)
Talking about me like they know

It has the same rhythm, the same 8-syllable last line, it even sounds similar.



and you know what, Eliot plagerised it from somewhere else too Laughing Laughing

and the we'll turn round Mr. Green
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PostPost #21  Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

in "a clockwork orange" one of the "miloko-plus" drinks available to alex and his droogs has "extra-knives"to"sharpen"one up.in my eperience this is the primary effect of taking me ol' favourite. smoking speed is mostly an inefficient method-i've been doing it for 20 years and snorting/eating it gives you the best "result to life expectancy"ratio(playing "pin-the-tail-on-the-donkey" is almost always a slippery slope IMHO;longterm needle freaks will disagree but sharing dirty works to jack-up water is by no means the lowest practise i've witnessed).
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PostPost #22  Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

p.s.when i first heard the song in'85 ithought the lyric was "nothing but the night to live for/one line,all i need"which seemed to work almost as well...just when you thought you knew everything...
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PostPost #23  Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:
in "a clockwork orange" one of the "miloko-plus" drinks available to alex and his droogs has "extra-knives"to"sharpen"one up.in my eperience this is the primary effect of taking me ol' favourite. smoking speed is mostly an inefficient method-i've been doing it for 20 years and snorting/eating it gives you the best "result to life expectancy"ratio(playing "pin-the-tail-on-the-donkey" is almost always a slippery slope IMHO;longterm needle freaks will disagree but sharing dirty works to jack-up water is by no means the lowest practise i've witnessed).


Surely eating it is the safest way because I heard if you snort it too much you start sneezing out chunks of your nose, like that guy from Status Quo.

I also heard getting it in pill form is extremely hard because Speed is sold cut to very low purity, 5%-10%. Ecstasy is more expensive than Speed so dealers can charge more for an ecstasy pill than they could for Speed, so they sell Speed as fake ecstascy, is this true?
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PostPost #24  Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

speed, smack, strychnine. all used.

Safest way is to get MDMA crystals. It wasn't me...
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PostPost #25  Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

nick the stripper wrote:
I also heard getting it in pill form is extremely hard because Speed is sold cut to very low purity, 5%-10%. Ecstasy is more expensive than Speed so dealers can charge more for an ecstasy pill than they could for Speed, so they sell Speed as fake ecstascy, is this true?


No. A gram of speed costs more than an E.

E started off more expensive, but prices plummetted in the early part of this decade as availability rocketed (and the purity of E consequently dived).

E's are (or were, a couple of years back, when I last partook) doing a good impression of the old Italian Lire.
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