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Sisters Successful?
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streamline
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PostPost #1  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 11:01 am    Post subject: Sisters Successful? Reply with quote Back to top

As this is my 666th post, I thought I'd be devilish Evil or Very Mad


I was reading a copy of Heartland this morning and came across this interesting Merciful Release press release which I thought is a little bit ironic considering what has happened (or hasn't) since 1993....

It dates from the time of the Sisterhood/m*****n spat and goes a little bit like this...

"It is apparent that Wayne and Craig have concluded that successful bands issue records not disclaimers........ Their logic is unassailable"

So are the Sisters still "successful" bearing in mind their lack of releases? Evil or Very Mad

I wonder if that particular Merciful Release employee can look back now and laugh, especially as the m*****n have been releasing albums ever since.....

Wink
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PostPost #2  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

When you do something, you have a task in mind.
When you achieve that, you are successfull.
What task did the Sisters have?
Initially, be played on radio. Checked, confirmed, success.
Next, get inside our heads. Partially successfull, I´d say.
What other tasks might have been set?
World domination?
Get pished, destroy? Wink

(Edit: I see it in my mind: Streamline sitting in front of his computer, thinking "I must reply-But this is the number of the beast, not just the neighbour of the beast! But I gotta reply to that ******, but it´s the number... Laughing )
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PostPost #3  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

succesful in terms of longevity, definitely; still touring and evolving.

they are wrongly credited as being the epitome of goth, but only because they influenced every goth band that came after into wanting to sound like them and so successfully impacted sufficiently on the scene to be given their iconic place in the rock 'n' roll hall of fame.

successfully fought and won a contractual battle with one of the biggest multinational corporations (though the cost was high- no records Sad ) in the name of artistic integrity and refusing to compromise.

they were on top of the pops.

gained one of the most obssessive and loyal fanbases in the world.
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PostPost #4  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:
succesful in terms of longevity, definitely; still touring and evolving.

they are wrongly credited as being the epitome of goth, but only because they influenced every goth band that came after into wanting to sound like them and so successfully impacted sufficiently on the scene to be given their iconic place in the rock 'n' roll hall of fame.

successfully fought and won a contractual battle with one of the biggest multinational corporations (though the cost was high- no records Sad ) in the name of artistic integrity and refusing to compromise.

they were on top of the pops.

gained one of the most obssessive and loyal fanbases in the world.

...in the wake of which a global community got founded, resulting in friendships across the globe and occasional weddings, births...
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PostPost #5  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

eotunun wrote:


(Edit: I see it in my mind: Streamline sitting in front of his computer, thinking "I must reply-But this is the number of the beast, not just the neighbour of the beast! But I gotta reply to that ******, but it´s the number... Laughing )


Bugger! You got me Laughing

I think you and Lee have both made valid points with regard to how successful the girls have been).
The reason I posted is that I thought it funny that in 1986 (ish) this press release came out equating "success" with releasing records.

While I agree that the Sisters have been successful in many, many ways, I think it is ironic that the one area in which they are lacking (releasing records) is they very one quoted by Merciful Release as being the way to become successful!

I hope that last sentence makes sense (my brain hurts!)
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PostPost #6  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Why is the m*****n is the swear word filter and blanked out with little *****
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PostPost #7  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

indy wrote:
Why is the m*****n is the swear word filter and blanked out with little *****


For laughs and giggles Wink
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PostPost #8  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

indy wrote:
Why is the m*****n is the swear word filter and blanked out with little *****

You're at a Sisters Of Mercy forum; take a wild guess... Twisted Evil
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PostPost #9  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:


successfully fought and won a contractual battle with one of the biggest multinational corporations (though the cost was high- no records Sad ) in the name of artistic integrity and refusing to compromise.

.


Errrmmmm...if you mean 'successfully avoided releasing the records they agreed to release', you're right! They've been amazingly successful! Even if Von was right that the Company didn't understand him or his music, and that they'd have promoted it badly, even dressed it in a pink fluffy cover, this 'victory' is not the tiniest flake of skin from the Company's nose. I suspect we agree on this. The spoils of victory for Von? A sense that he's his own man, and can do things his own way, I guess - but he had this is buckets already. And the cost to Von? The fact that most people who even remember the band's name when they see a rare concert advertised think they're just idle chancers cashing in on an 80s-nostalgia-trip. And who can say they're wrong to think that?
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PostPost #10  Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

'A rare concert'? So what was last year's tour all about then? Not to mention the fact I and many other have seen the Girls at least five times in as many years and they were always near to or effectively sold out. Yup, we all must be 'idle chancers who cash in on the 80's nostalgia trip' then. All 1500 (more or less) of us... Mr. Green
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PostPost #11  Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

The audience are not the idle chancers - read the post. Some people might think the BAND were in the same boat as ABC, Human League etc etc - touring so that a mixture of diehard fans and the curious who remember the 80s heyday continue to pay the mortgage. It's an impression you could form; I didn't say it was right or wrong, but given that the Sisters haven't released a new album for 17 years I'm not sure where the chink in the argument is...
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PostPost #12  Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

MrChris wrote:
The audience are not the idle chancers - read the post. Some people might think the BAND were in the same boat as ABC, Human League etc etc - touring so that a mixture of diehard fans and the curious who remember the 80s heyday continue to pay the mortgage. It's an impression you could form; I didn't say it was right or wrong, but given that the Sisters haven't released a new album for 17 years I'm not sure where the chink in the argument is...

We are not worthy! We are not worthy! We are not worthy!

And it's totally understandable that an outsider looking in would see things this way. Unfortunately Von has gotten himself into this position, and probably really only has himself to blame for it in the end.
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PostPost #13  Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

What I can't understand is: What the heck is the MR label good for? If it's all for the money that he didn't sign a contract, why doesn't he hire some good folks to promote his Sissies and brings out an EP, a Single, an Album and another Single - direct revenue and all in his own hands. Can't be that expensive to produce some songs... with a drum machine and only 2 musicians to get paid Wink
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PostPost #14  Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I think Adam holds the stuff that he has co-written under embargo? MR only exists in name nowadays, surely.
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PostPost #15  Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Are they successful? Of course they are bloody successful!

They're outside the system that some of us are stuck in.

'2006 : TWENTY-EIGHT COUNTRIES. WE NEED TO GET OUT LESS.'

says it all.

And that's without being pimped out by some blood sucking record company or degrading themselves by being sponsored by the likes of Ronald McDonald.

We are not worthy! We are not worthy! We are not worthy! We are not worthy! We are not worthy! We are not worthy!
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PostPost #16  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Not that it counts to me in any way, I recently looked up and wrote down the UK chart postions they reached with the different singles. If you are interested:

Temple Of Love 1983 - Position nr 24
Body & Soul - Position nr 25
Walk Away - Position nr 31
No Time To Cry - Position nr 29
First And LAst And Always - Position nr 16
This Corrosion - Position nr 7
Dominion - Position nr 13
Lucretia - Position nr 20
More - Position nr 14
Dr. Jeep - Position nr 37
Temple Of Love 1992 - Position nr 3
Under The Gun - Position nr 19

Smile
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PostPost #17  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Ozpat wrote:
Not that it counts to me in any way, I recently looked up and wrote down the UK chart postions they reached with the different singles. If you are interested:

Temple Of Love 1983 - Position nr 24
Body & Soul - Position nr 25
Walk Away - Position nr 31
No Time To Cry - Position nr 29
First And LAst And Always - Position nr 16
This Corrosion - Position nr 7
Dominion - Position nr 13
Lucretia - Position nr 20
More - Position nr 14
Dr. Jeep - Position nr 37
Temple Of Love 1992 - Position nr 3
Under The Gun - Position nr 19

Smile


Those first 4 singles on your list, definately didn't chart in the national charts.
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PostPost #18  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

IIRC Body And Soul troubled the lower reaches of the top 75

*Edit: UK top 40 positions according to everyhit.com:
Code:
Position   Artist              Title                    Date
7          Sisters Of Mercy    This Corrosion           Oct 1987
13         Sisters Of Mercy    Dominion                 Feb 1988
20         Sisters Of Mercy    Lucretia My Reflection   Jun 1988
14         Sisters Of Mercy    More                     Oct 1990
37         Sisters Of Mercy    Doctor Jeep              Dec 1990
3          Sisters Of Mercy    Temple Of Love           May 1992
19         Sisters Of Mercy    Under The Gun            Aug 1993

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PostPost #19  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Spiggy's hat wrote:
Ozpat wrote:
Not that it counts to me in any way, I recently looked up and wrote down the UK chart postions they reached with the different singles. If you are interested:

Temple Of Love 1983 - Position nr 24
Body & Soul - Position nr 25
Walk Away - Position nr 31
No Time To Cry - Position nr 29


Smile


Those first 4 singles on your list, definately didn't chart in the national charts.


Agreed. The last 2 weren't far off, but these figures are wrong.
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PostPost #20  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

in many ways it is a sign that you don't need records and record companes that they still pack out stadia around the world... (or until recently the internet, though Von doesn't use that for MR anyway)
they seem to ahve somehow missed out the awkwark/awful mid career of most aging rock bands (from the Stones to U2 and back again)
ie. release ground breaking material
tour
tour lots
change line-up
repeat ad infinitum
most mega-bands have also released a slew of mediocre albums that even the fans think are patchy, but not tsom!

tsom are successful precisely because they have surived without records and von knows he has written 10ish great songs in the last 15 years. that really kick-ass.
rather than 3 albums with 3 good songs on each and then filled with material he wouldn't tour with anyway!

We are not worthy! Our fearless leader!
if we weren't used to being fed music by a commercial enterprise how von runs tsom would be the norm and was untill the 78's in the 1920's

from a personal perspective most of the music i rate really highly comes from artists who have had 'turbulent' recording careers/own lables
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PostPost #21  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

MrChris wrote:
Spiggy's hat wrote:
Ozpat wrote:
Not that it counts to me in any way, I recently looked up and wrote down the UK chart postions they reached with the different singles. If you are interested:

Temple Of Love 1983 - Position nr 24
Body & Soul - Position nr 25
Walk Away - Position nr 31
No Time To Cry - Position nr 29


Smile


Those first 4 singles on your list, definately didn't chart in the national charts.


Agreed. The last 2 weren't far off, but these figures are wrong.


I know I read it somewhere as I wrote it down. Can't remember where as it is a while ago. Rolling Eyes

Agreed....they must be wrong.
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PostPost #22  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

If the new songs are that great why haven't they released it or gotten a contract with one of the major labels? In all honesty, they should have released an album in 1998. That's when the momentum was there, the band were out of their WEA contract and the audience was ready for it. They failed and I'm sure looking back on it know it is considered a missed opportunity to reignite Eldritch's career. Question really is, does he want this. The songs written since are only a handful (as far as we can gather) and what is there now would just about fill an album by today's standards. IMHO the Sisters career is now definitly stalling, as the offering of a downgraded/less expensive package for promotors on the last tour surely proved. Its a shame as the post-'96 angle deserves better and for all intends and purposes Eldritch could have done a Gary Numan if he'd being willing to do so. Apparently not.
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PostPost #23  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

King of Byblos wrote:
We are not worthy! Our fearless leader!
if we weren't used to being fed music by a commercial enterprise how von runs tsom would be the norm and was untill the 78's in the 1920's

That's exactly what I've been repeating for years. So many people who in fact are true Sisters' fans don't seem to realise how all this talk about The New Album is biased by the whole record industry monster (or as you call it commercial enterprise).
Sure it would be lovely to hear this New Album one day, but for me the one and only reason is that I'd love to hear polished, clear-sounding studio versions of the songs that I have to listen to on bootlegs. Other reasons I don't care about.
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PostPost #24  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

_emma_ wrote:
King of Byblos wrote:
We are not worthy! Our fearless leader!
if we weren't used to being fed music by a commercial enterprise how von runs tsom would be the norm and was untill the 78's in the 1920's

That's exactly what I've been repeating for years. So many people who in fact are true Sisters' fans don't seem to realise how all this talk about The New Album is biased by the whole record industry monster (or as you call it commercial enterprise).
Sure it would be lovely to hear this New Album one day, but for me the one and only reason is that I'd love to hear polished, clear-sounding studio versions of the songs that I have to listen to on bootlegs. Other reasons I don't care about.


Very Happy DEF
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PostPost #25  Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Karst wrote:
If the new songs are that great why haven't they released it or gotten a contract with one of the major labels?


No major label is going to touch him in this time of uncertainty for the industry (starting in the late 90's with the rise of Napster, etc). The fact is that he has a reputation for being difficult to work with, he failed to undertake a promotional tour for a major record (Floodland), he went on strike because he didn't like how the label was handling his band, the band itself is not the sort of thing that will be easily marketed, regardless of how good the new songs are (and I think they are quite good, except for Romeo Down, which sounds unfinished to me when performed live). When freed from his contract, my understanding is that they soon had a European deal worked out, but not an American one. He'll never land a major label deal in the US for the simple fact that he doesn't fit the artistic (and I use the word loosely) mold of what gets done here. He might have had a shot at something like Rick Rubin's American Records (though I'm sure he'd loathe the name It wasn't me... ), and he probably should have followed such well-respected talents as Tom Waits, Nick Cave and Merle Haggard to Anti/Epitaph, which would probably have been happy to have him, and wouldn't have interfered with the band overmuch. For whatever the reason, a band like his isn't going to get a major label deal, either now or then, in the States. They could get a big indie deal, probably still, if they wanted it.

I should also add that I think Von probably gerts a perverse glee out of trying to see how long he can keep the band profitable without a record.
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